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dnd 5e – Does a Ring of Spell Turning work on spells upcast to target an additional creature? – Role-playing Games Stack Exchange

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11/12/2022
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Which Specific rule overrides which General Rule?

The general rules get override or have exceptions made throughout the game by specific rules, which is distinctly stated in the PHB under “ specific Beats General ”

many racial traits, class features, spells, charming items, monster abilities, and other game elements break the general rules … Magic accounts for most of the exceptions to the rules. ( PHB p. 7 ) .

The ring works as advertised for the wearer

  1. What you are dealing with hera is two specific rules in conflict : one of which is the magic token specific rule, and the other is either the Twin specific rule, or the upcast specific. That means that an answer needs to rely on a bit of judgment to form a govern.

    Reading: dnd 5e – Does a Ring of Spell Turning work on spells upcast to target an additional creature? – Role-playing Games Stack Exchange

  2. Negating a magic detail takes an antimagic field, which is an eighth level while ( charming effect ) .
  3. Spells create charming effects.
    Modifications to spells, such as gemini or upcasting, are modifications to a discrete charming effect .

    A spell is a discrete charming impression ( see What is a spell ? PHB, p. 201 ) .

Ruling: the ring wearer gets the benefit of the ring, the other target does not.

Why ?
The closed chain ‘s charming protective features is applying its charming effect to a single target ; there is a single charming effect affecting the target of the declare person spell, and that charming effect is not an area of effect. The target is the ring wearer. The early aim of the spell gets no such protection, because that target is not wearing the hoop. ( And if it were, it besides would get the protective covering ).
This question is more clearly answered from the perspective of the target(s) not from the perspective of the spell caster.
Why ?
Because you are dealing with multiple “ specifics ” to deal with Hold Person ‘s “ general. ” The target not wearing the ring gets no protective covering .
What the caster is doing, by applying an extra resource ( be it meta charming points or added go slots ) to the single target enchantment as cast, either by twinning or by upcasting to choose an extra prey, is creating a second exemplify of a discrete go consequence. The upcast is not creating an sphere of consequence spell, nor is the counterpart. The only caveat regarding the ring of spell turning not applying advantage to the spell save is the application of an area of effect spell .

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At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 3rd level or higher, you can target one extra android for each slot level above 2nd. The humanoids must be within 30 feet of each early when you target them. ( basic Rules, p. 93 )

Notice that “ at higher levels ” does not hold all creatures in an area ; what it allows is for more than one creature In Range to be forced to save of be held .
The ring ‘s kernel protective feature is :

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you have advantage on saving throws against any enchantment that targets only you ( not in an area of consequence. )

Twinned is the easier case to address

The twin detention person can lone target you ; it takes the charming effect ( and expended resource ) of the biparous to apply the discrete charming effect of cargo area person to another target. From the frame of reference book of the ring, a single target spell is being attempted against the wearer. The other target gets no protective covering .

Upcasting is the trickier case

Because of “ how spells at higher grade ” work, there is some question as to which exception takes precedence : the accession of another aim, or the protective consequence of a legendary item ? The detail wins .

  • Compare what level of time, effort, and magic it takes to create a
    ring of spell turning (DMG. p. 129) 500,000 GP, 17th level minimum,
    and (500,000 GP) divided by (25 GP) character days (20,000~ 54.8
    years) to create. Note that it takes 8th level spell casting (first
    available at 15th level) to get access to an anti magic field, which
    would suppress the effects of this magic item.

Why ? The second ( or third, etc ) exemplify of defy person that comes from up casting does not convert the spell to an area of effect. What it does is create another charming effect that another creature has to save against. From the skeletal system of reference book of the surround, that early target may equally well not exist. Its charming is merely applicable to the wearer. The wearer gets advantage on the spare .

To rule otherwise is to apply 8th level magic to lower powered magical effects

In order to nullify the effects of a legendary charming detail by and large requires subjecting them to an anti magic field : an 8th level while impression. That ‘s is well more herculean magic than a 2d level spell, or the match meta magic trick .

But let’s bury ourselves in edge cases, as rules lawyers like to do

Were the Hold Person Spell to be cast at 8th flat, the gang of spell turning can not turn the magic trick back upon the wearer. That ‘s a limit of the detail .

The go expands to fill the slot it is put into ( p.201 )

The exemplify of defend person that the wearer is saving against is still based only on that person and they make their own spare. The other creatures are on their own.

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One could argue that having exceeded the spell level threshold of one protective feature of speech may arsenic well override all ring protective features ; the hold person effect at 8th level of casting overpowers the ring and no advantage would accrue to the saving throw. It ‘s a reach, but since spells grow to fill the world power of the slot when upcast, the encase could be made and 8th level is the same level of power/magic as the antimagic field mentioned previously. It ‘s a that goes into the grey area where the rules are not specific, but you can american samoa well argue that the 7th tied threshold lone applies to the plow, and differently the gang basically does its usual thing : protect the wearer from spells ( discrete charming effects ) directed at them .

A similar case of multiple instances of one spell: Eldritch Blast

Jeremy Crawford has ruled that if multiple blasts of Eldritch Blast hit the same creature, with the repelling blast invocation being active, each case of the blast moves the animal the 10 feet. This rule and the above intelligent is consistent with the point that a spell shed with multiple instances ( the eldritch gust must hit each in each meter for this to cultivate ) has each case treated individually. The caster in this character can spread the blasts to multiple creatures, or to one creature, but each exemplify has its own discrete charming impression .

That’s what a spell does: create a discrete magical effect.

The basic feature of the spell, hold person, is that it targets a unmarried creature. The upcast creates a parallel exemplify that does not effect the other targets. Applying extra instances of a go by either match or improving casting a “ single target ” to add extra targets does not change the nature of the spell .

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